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Health Care Bill

Nihilistic_Impact said:
I'd be a bad human being if I idly let someone spout off an inane idea that they don't care if someone goes and dies because they can't afford the basic standards of living.

Such immoral behaviour and I'm supposed to let the thought stand unopposed?

No, such thought should be combated and shown for what they are.
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You do not define morality.
Good luck in combating my ideals though, because when you get down to the bottom of it, you can't change my mind, and you can't convince me that I'm wrong or that I need to change. So please, don't waste your breath or you will just look like a helpless idiot.
 
I don't think I can, it's not you I'm trying to convince. It's those that waiver on the edge.

And I don't define morality. I just ascribe to a humanistic and utilitarian view point.

In the end this is not futile as you just display your gross ethos, you're the villain.
 
Nihilistic_Impact said:
I don't think I can, it's not you I'm trying to convince. It's those that waiver on the edge.

And I don't define morality. I just ascribe to a humanistic and utilitarian view point.

In the end this is not futile as you just display your gross ethos, you're the villain.
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To others I may indeed be, but guess what? Not only do I not care for the well-being of others, but I don't care about their opinions either. Am I even more of a villain now?. I could honestly care less about the others that waiver on the edge, they have a right to choose their opinion on situations. Have fun with your "moral and compassionate crusade", I know I'll find it amusing.
 
WolfHero said:
Exactly.

Who are you to define what is emotionally immature and what is not? I have a right not to give a damn about anyone else, and I DON'T give a damn about anyone else. Quit trying to say that I'm obligated to care about others because I am not, and you have no factual basis to prove that I am supposed to, or that it's emotionally immature. It's complete and utter bullshit.

It's so funny to see you people get so defensive and hostile whenever someone abides by the above quoted statement. At some point, you have to realize that I have a right to care about me and only me, and if you can't realize that, then you're the ones that are emotionally immature for being in denial.

Really it seems like it's you that has no idea what the fuck they're talking about. Take off your rose colored glasses.
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You say this, then at the same time demand that I respect your opinion. Typical hypocrite.

Someone you know helped pay for the smallpox eradication program. You have done your part to create resistant bacterial strains. I'm not claiming that you should care about other people - you're an asshole and proud, fine. I'll give you the same respect you give others - which is none, as you admit.

If you go to the hospital for something like a knee surgery and end up contracting something like MRSA?
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I know you won't be offended that you are one of the few people who I would not care about contracting something like that. Not necessarily MRSA itself - it just represents a trend.

Your 'lack of concern' is what drives that, and uncounted resistant strains like it, now and through the future. It's already hitting you in the pocketbook, and the only nation in the world that has been able to stop it has done so in part because of their universal program.

Your 'lack of concern' is precisely why bioterrorism is in fact a threat, and why the sorts of people who do long-term national planning are scared shitless about it.

The reaction is not about you being morally wrong in any way. You are in fact factually wrong, and your lack of concern about this actually harms everyone else, as well as yourself.

You pay more for insurance because of this, you are more likely to die a horrific death at the hands of a disease we don't know how to fight, and you make the overall national response to active bioterrorism harder.

One of these days I'd like to see every sociopath like you build a community on principles like that. And watch how fast it disintegrates.
 
Nihilistic_Impact said:
It's called Somalia.
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No, there are in fact actually a lot of people trying to do good for their fellow Somalian there.

I've read studies involving cooperative games stacked with sociopaths. There are certainly roles the heartless have in society. But the only place they are going to run one is into the ground.
 
How am I being a hypocrite?
I don't care if you respect my opinion or agree with it, just as I don't respect you, or your opinion. You will however, accept that it is my opinion, and that I am certainly entitled to it just as I accept your opinion and believe that you have every right to harbor it. If you can't accept my opinion, then that makes you a hypocrite.

Also, both of you dumbfucks are completely misunderstanding my stance. There is a difference in seeing a person starving and laughing, than there is seeing a person starving and not giving a shit, because in the end you realize that you have food, and that's all that really matters. I subscribe to the latter. It's not that I want harm to befall onto people. It's just that I don't care if it does, or if it doesn't.
 
Then I think what they're commenting on is the kind of moral stuntedness you describe. I believe their point is that the kind of shortsightedness that you subscribe to has led us to this point, basically, and if everybody felt that way throughout history, we'd still be living in caves and killing each other for tanned hides.

If I'm understanding correctly, it's more along the lines of the "I got mine, fuck you all" attitude is what kills civilization and reduces us to essentially little more than animals. Which, we are animals, but we tend to have higher aspirations, and the whole process of civilization and rule of law and why we don't just bash each other's brains in whenever we see an advantage is rather predicated on the idea that we don't always act like the animals we physically are.

But we can't all be evolved together, I suppose.
 
WolfHero is trying too hard. You can smell the defense mechanism clear as day.

The idea is simple. Everyone plays along, everyone wins. Emotionally traumatized broken souls like yourself, however, have this very mistaken idea that they can avoid being social, which is, unfortunately, in your very genes, and only the most warped and nonfunctional of people behave in such a fashion.

You are an aberration, and thus, your opinion is void, much as any insane person's word salad would be. No, it's doing it too much credit to call it an 'opinion' - It's mental illness, simple as that.

This is immaterial, however. The system is democratic, and the majority is moving - Slowly, haltingly, stupidly, but moving - in the right path. Accept it and take advantage of your resources to get some counseling.
 
I still firmly believe that what your all eventually expecting will never come to pass.
You say that humans will eventually get there. The past million years have proven otherwise. I'll pay and go along with it. However, in the end it's going to fail.

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What happens when these volunteer doctors get tired of treating people for free, or for a fraction of what they used to get paid hmmm, is a nationwide doctors strike looming? Also consider the fact that there is still not enough doctors to treat all these people that now have healthcare! Not that it's the peoples fault. It's just facts. It takes 8 years for a person to gain the knowledge to practice. However, it's estimated that 50,000 new doctors will be needed by 2020, everything from General Practitioners, Pediatrician, to Brain Surgeons.

It's just not going to happen. I'm calling it now, and in 10 years, I'll say I told you so.

Don't misunderstand, I do hope that people eventually get to the point where things like this are feasible.

However, do me a favor? All of you.
Shit in one hand, and hope in the other......see which fill up first and get back to me.
 
Tathariel said:
I still firmly believe that what your all eventually expecting will never come to pass.
You say that humans will eventually get there. The past million years have proven otherwise. I'll pay and go along with it. However, in the end it's going to fail.

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What happens when these volunteer doctors get tired of treating people for free, or for a fraction of what they used to get paid hmmm, is a nationwide doctors strike looming? Also consider the fact that there is still not enough doctors to treat all these people that now have healthcare! Not that it's the peoples fault. It's just facts. It takes 8 years for a person to gain the knowledge to practice. However, it's estimated that 50,000 new doctors will be needed by 2020, everything from General Practitioners, Pediatrician, to Brain Surgeons.

It's just not going to happen. I'm calling it now, and in 10 years, I'll say I told you so.

Don't misunderstand, I do hope that people eventually get to the point where things like this are feasible.

However, do me a favor? All of you.
Shit in one hand, and hope in the other......see which fill up first and get back to me.
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Elliquiy's just had its fifth birthday, I expect Blue Moon to see its fifteenth. Someone remind me to reflect on this post in a decade's time if Tath is still with us. Especially the bit about people whose entire profession being based off of helping others 'getting tired of it'.
 
Yes, every other first, second, and many third world nations have had health care for decades, and they're all experiencing a sharp drop in doctors and people are dying in the very streets because they can't get in hospital, and...

Oh, wait, most of that is untrue. All but the "had health care for decades" business.
 
LOL@Hahvy

All we can do is wait, and see how it turns out.


Hey! Remember what they said about deregulating banks??? Look how that turned out. : )

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Yes.....yes......stare at it......and fall ever deeper into its grasp.

"I will make it legal."
―Darth Sidious
 
Tathariel said:
LOL@Hahvy

All we can do is wait, and see how it turns out.

Hey! Remember what they said about deregulating banks??? Look how that turned out. : )
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I have no idea what you said about deregulation. But I've seen it as a bad idea for 20 years; deregulation is great for large businesses, sucks for pretty much everybody else. So if that's what you said, then I agree. But I disagree on health care. And being right once doesn't guarantee anything -- you know what they say about a stopped clock.
 
That is what I meant MM.

True, being right once does not make you right about everything.

Oh, well. Either it works or it doesn't. Everyone will find out by 2020 I suppose.
 
They aren't mutually exclusive.

Deregulating the banks lead to the current situation.

Health Care is only just now getting stricter regulations, it was looser.

So what we're seeing is that deregulation in general does not work for the benefit of society.
 
Deregulation is just a nicer of way of saying we let big business cut corners so they can save on their over head.

Imagine the kinds of death traps we'd be driving in and living in if we reduced safety standards on building codes and cars.

Or are seat belts unhealthy for us?
 
Hell YES! Them thangs save lives, yo!- Richard Kendrick, Bremerton High Homecoming King 08.
Quote from our yearbook, when asked "should drivers get fined for not wearing seatbelts"
 
Tathariel said:
Hell YES! Them thangs save lives, yo!- Richard Kendrick, Bremerton High Homecoming King 08.
Quote from our yearbook, when asked "should drivers get fined for not wearing seatbelts"
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I always find a few people who say "If I [or brother/sister/cousin/whatever] had been wearing a seat-belt... dead now." And while that's true, in that specific case, it doesn't outweigh vast piles of statistical evidence to the contrary, and I always wonder if those people are going to die in their next bad accident thinking that lightning will strike twice, so to speak. So Mr. Kendrick had the right idea. Good on him.
 
--+Hahvoc Requiem+-- said:
Wait, wait, Wolfhero- I'll go with your philosophy.

I don't give a shit if you have an "opinion."

:)​
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I never asked anyone to give a shit. I don't care if anyone gives a shit. My opinion, to me, is the only one that matters. If someone else wants to be a humanitarian, great. Go out and do your thing, I won't object to it. I won't care. What's truly funny, and actually pretty shocking is how all of you people are reacting to my opinion.


WolfHero is trying too hard. You can smell the defense mechanism clear as day.

The idea is simple. Everyone plays along, everyone wins. Emotionally traumatized broken souls like yourself, however, have this very mistaken idea that they can avoid being social, which is, unfortunately, in your very genes, and only the most warped and nonfunctional of people behave in such a fashion.

You are an aberration, and thus, your opinion is void, much as any insane person's word salad would be. No, it's doing it too much credit to call it an 'opinion' - It's mental illness, simple as that.

This is immaterial, however. The system is democratic, and the majority is moving - Slowly, haltingly, stupidly, but moving - in the right path. Accept it and take advantage of your resources to get some counseling.
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I've been called 'heartless' and a 'bastard' before. But labeling me a sociopath? Calling me insane? There is nothing about me that validates any opinion that I am 'mentally ill'. It's called a lack of compassion, and indifference to the well-being of others.

And yes, I am trying too hard, and it's embarassing that you people can seriously not comprehend my opinion. But I suppose that I am after all, a hypocrite indeed since you humanitarians are essentially doing the same thing I am doing. Let's just face it, I don't give a damn about the human garbage that should conveinently die off so that I can keep more of my money. Hell, the world is overpopulated anyway, and the savages crossing the border to the south are breeding like rabbits and are not only producing more and more waste that I have to pay for, but are adding more and more to the world's already inflated population. And you guys do care. That's fine.

This all being said, I most definitely support a government program for comdoms and mandatory birth control for those who fall under the poverty line. I would have no problem paying a little for a big reward in return.
 
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