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Magic The Gathering Thread

U

UnluckyGambit

Super-Earth
Joined
Feb 25, 2014
Location
Not in Vegas
Hello my fellow Planeswalkers,

Welcome a a gathering place where we may discuss the trading card game Magic the Gathering. Here we can discuss cards, decks, deck combinations, and the like here. Hopefully we will engage in jolly cooperation as we discuss a similar hobby we all have. My only request is that we respect one another, we're all friend here.

Some topic starters: http://rumandmonkey.com/widgets/toys/testgen/5261/#.U2sDSvldXJL

I am white/blue:
I'm both orderly and rational. I value control, information, and order. I love structure and hierarchy, and will actively use whatever power or knowledge I have to maintain it. At best, I am lawful and insightful; at worst, I am bureaucratic and tyrannical.

I like both of those colors, so it is fairly accurate, but I also like how Green decks work.

Also one of my goals in a four way free for all involves these two cards, in this order.

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=WORLDFIRE

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?multiverseid=26266&type=card

We all lose!
 
That combo would get a lot of people angry with you really quick, and you would run out of people to play the game with.
That being said, it's easy enough to do if you play Grixis: Cast Maggot Carrier, cast Quicken on the stack to cast Worldfire on the stack. Everyone down to 1, Maggot Carrier enters the battlefield, everyone dead.
 
I've had a friend do a similar move, only he used an Artifact, oblivion ring if i remember correctly, to banish (i forget the actual term at the moment) a creature, then world fired us, destroying the ring and killed us all, winning the game before we could get anything out. Cool the first time, argued every time after that.

Anyway, i currently run a Nicko Bolas deck (as i call it) against my friends, and a green deck as a back up. Want to turn that green deck into wolf and spider though, love the effects they give and garner.
 
I run Green Devotion standard, and blue artifacts modern. Both are fun, both are terrifying when they run right.
 
sliiiiiiiverrrrrrrrs

When I played (07) I used red/black slivers with a dash of burn, because regular slivers weren't fast enough for me.
 
The test gave me Black/Blue, which is fairly accurate.

I am Black/Blue (Aka Dimir): I am both selfish and rational. I use manipulation, deception and information to get my own way; at best I am discreet and efficient; at worst, I am scheming and untrustworthy.

Okay, maybe partially true. >_> Depends on the circumstances. I swear I'm a good guy... Eek.

Regardless, I have a variety of decks and am planning several more out. Making decks is the most fun part of magic to me. Doing the research, coming up with weird concepts, etc.

I have a basic white control deck using Fiend Hunter/Oblivion Ring as it's backbone, with Elesh Norn as my main 'win' condition, along with protection cards for her. (Like Brave the Elements)
I have a black/blue Zombie deck, which was my first deck. It's very simplistic and the main win condition is Call to the grave, along with Door of Destinies.
I have a deck based around the idea of using Conjurer's closet. The main win condition for it are Lavinia of the tenth and Urbis protector, but every creature in the deck does something when entering the battlefield. Cloudshifts are also included.
I have a blue 'play with your deck' deck, which only uses cards my opponents controls. Stolen goods, Clone, Simic Manipulator, Dream Leash and the likes are the win conditions of this deck. Perplexing Chimera is a fun addition to it and will make your opponent think twice before casting THEIR win condition.
And finally there's my commander, Thraximundar. A red/black/blue commander, which of course, includes Nicol Bolas as one of it's cards. There's no real 'combo' for this deck, rather, it's a collection of powerful/useful (but cheap, I'm on a budget. XD) cards which eventually lead to me winning... Or not~ Old Thraxi himself does a lot of work when summoned though.
 
I haven't played Magic in a while. I did get into the Avacyn block when it came out because, you know, sexy-ass angels, but other than that I haven't played hardcore in years. My go-to color combos have always been red/green, red/white, and white/green. I love the combination of control, burn, and fatties that these colors usually bring to the table.

Now I miss my Mayael the Anima Commander deck...​
 
I am still learning what works best for me, I have a black/red unleash deck but I love my white deck even if Hal smashed it to little pieces.
 
Raziel99 said:
That combo would get a lot of people angry with you really quick, and you would run out of people to play the game with.
That being said, it's easy enough to do if you play Grixis: Cast Maggot Carrier, cast Quicken on the stack to cast Worldfire on the stack. Everyone down to 1, Maggot Carrier enters the battlefield, everyone dead.
Click to expand...


I manage to piss people off regardless what I do....-.-''' I'm not even that hardcore of a player, I just use the cards that I have. All my decks are quite beatable. I still inflict rage with Washout.

Guess I should describe my decks. I have a green black, big monster, super ramp deck that includes Enlarge and Thorn Elemental. Advocate of the Beast, Ivy Lane Citizen, and Gyre Sage.

Green Black Zombie, clear the field deck, that takes advantage of Strength of Night's kicker ability.

A Blue Green that involves control and counters with a combo revolving around Setssan Oathsworn and various enchantments.

Then finally a red white get creatures on the field and roll with a few direct damage spells like Lava axe.
 
Oh hey, MTG is a wonderful thing. I enjoy a lot of different decks and ideas and nonsense. I'm currently working on a deck that I've been wanting to make forever but haven't had the time/money to make (sadly :( )

http://www.mtgvault.com/micbunny/decks/manaless-dredge/ If anyone is interested.

But when playing with friends I tend to go for silly tribal shenanigans. Recently made a bear deck that does silly if mostly useless things. It's pretty ok in multiplayer just because it can get a surprising number of bears on the field if left alone for a bit, and then overrun suddenly takes over a game. :p
 
Ah, manaless dredge. It's alright. It generally wins 80-90% of game 1, then 10% of game 2 in modern. its just too easy to stop.
 
Well it's easier to stop in modern because most of the good hate for it is in modern and the best discard is not. It's got a bit more staying power ironically in legacy just due to access to better discard. But yes it's still a bit "flimsier" game 2. I mostly like it because of its wonderfully favorable match ups (especially post board) to Show and Tell strategies. That and I've loved dredge as a concept since forever. I just haven't been able to get enough to manaless it. And certainly don't have the cards to LED it.
 
The problem with saying "it works better in Legacy" is that 90% of Legacy games end turn 2/3, and Dredge takes several turns to set up. Dredge works far better in Modern, but it's easily countered with stuff like Tormod's Crype.
 
Tormod's crypt is actually not too bad. And most legacy games don't actually "end" on turn 2/3. In ideal circumstances they do but then under ideal circumstances, Manaless can combo win on turn 2. Turn 1, draw, discard Phantasmagorian. During opponents EOT, discard all but one card in hand, discarding (in this order.) Nether shadow, Golgari Grave Troll, Balustrade Spy, Any creature, Dread Return, Bridge from Below. Turn 2 upkeep Nether Shadow comes out of the graveyard. During draw, Dredge Gravetroll, getting any combination from the mill 6 of 2 narcomebas, A narco a bridge from below and a cabal therapy, two bridges and a cabal therapy (basically, any combination that would allow it to make three creatures that turn.) Then flashback dread return targeting balustrade spy. Target yourself with ETB trigger, mill entire deck. Make more zombies with Bridges and cabal therapies, flashback another dread return targeting Flayer of the hatebound, Flashback another dreadreturn targeting a golagri grave troll, shoot opponent for ~40 damage.

Dredge works far better in legacy only because Cabal Therapy and Unmask and Nether shadow and Ichorid are legal in it, and are not in modern, while modern still has the threat of turn 1 or 2 Rest in Peace or Grafdigger's Cage, which are essentially GG if resolved.
 
And here I come, all casual and stuff with my mono-green squirrel deck, trampling every single person with a wast army of small furry critters~
 
Squirrels are a quite fun deck. Small furry critter related death is probably the best way to induce it.
 
Micbunny said:
Tormod's crypt is actually not too bad. And most legacy games don't actually "end" on turn 2/3. In ideal circumstances they do but then under ideal circumstances, Manaless can combo win on turn 2. Turn 1, draw, discard Phantasmagorian. During opponents EOT, discard all but one card in hand, discarding (in this order.) Nether shadow, Golgari Grave Troll, Balustrade Spy, Any creature, Dread Return, Bridge from Below. Turn 2 upkeep Nether Shadow comes out of the graveyard. During draw, Dredge Gravetroll, getting any combination from the mill 6 of 2 narcomebas, A narco a bridge from below and a cabal therapy, two bridges and a cabal therapy (basically, any combination that would allow it to make three creatures that turn.) Then flashback dread return targeting balustrade spy. Target yourself with ETB trigger, mill entire deck. Make more zombies with Bridges and cabal therapies, flashback another dread return targeting Flayer of the hatebound, Flashback another dreadreturn targeting a golagri grave troll, shoot opponent for ~40 damage.

Dredge works far better in legacy only because Cabal Therapy and Unmask and Nether shadow and Ichorid are legal in it, and are not in modern, while modern still has the threat of turn 1 or 2 Rest in Peace or Grafdigger's Cage, which are essentially GG if resolved.
Click to expand...

Hey look, a perfect hand theory that falls to a single Force of Will, which all blue decks in Legacy will run 4 of. Which in a game a blue deck that goes second will have at least 1 counter ready if not more.

That being said, 'it falls to counter' arguments and 'perfect turn 2 win' arguments are naturally invalid because while it's true it happens, the percent is infinitely small for it. Also, Tormod's Crypt turn 1 still stops that, as well as a few other grave hate effects.
 
Raziel99 said:
Hey look, a perfect hand theory that falls to a single Force of Will, which all blue decks in Legacy will run 4 of. Which in a game a blue deck that goes second will have at least 1 counter ready if not more.

That being said, 'it falls to counter' arguments and 'perfect turn 2 win' arguments are naturally invalid because while it's true it happens, the percent is infinitely small for it. Also, Tormod's Crypt turn 1 still stops that, as well as a few other grave hate effects.
Click to expand...

Well I bring up a "perfect hand" argument because you claimed that it is bad because it is too slow and most games end in 2-3 turns. Assuming that your opponent has the perfect hand to go off, with force of will back up, while you don't have any action every game is kind of absurd. So I was merely showing that it has the ability to also go off incredibly fast, and there was still room in there to be more resistant to one force of will (a single cabal therapy can mess up force of wills if you know what to name.) And no matter what happens to the actual spell dread return or cabal therapy, you still get your zombie tokens off of bridge. It doesn't have to all in combo, it can do a pretty solid aggro game off of making a pile of zombies, or even just reanimating a random gravetroll and smacking people with it.

And you keep going back to Tormod's Crypt. Crypt has the problem of requiring to be activated to shut you down. Sure it is a free artifact, but there's also the issue of how many pure grave hate cards are decks going to bring? I'd guess most will bring 2, maybe 3, but a lot especially recently bring only 1 as they rely on Deathrite Shaman who is actually not the most effective unless he gets out soon enough to get all of your dredgers, and you never draw a street wraith. Rest in Peace and Grafdigger's cage are superior graveyard hate to Tormod's. Heck Relic of Progenitus is still better than Tormod's crypt. I'm not saying the deck isn't stopped by gravehate, it most certainly is. But it's not as flimsy as a 10% win rate in all post board match ups.

But if we're going to keep arguing this we should probably take it to PMs to stop from sidetracking the thread too much on legacy metagame discussion.
 
I bring up Tormod's Crypt simply because it's one of the cheapest alternatives for grave hate. As for how much grave hate is in player sideboards, it's completely dependent on when Dredge last one a tournament. Yes, you still have your zed's from Bridge, but they don't have haste and you just decked yourself. The combo you posted does work turn two, effectively but not without faults (just like any combo deck), but generally is much slower, normally seeing around turn 5 or 6 win for the build-up needed.


To compare, a friend of mine has a R/U Storm deck, which reliably runs a turn 3 win, turn 2 with perfect hand, with mana ramp and cantrips.

And I will admit that I embellished with 10% win on game 2's. It's closer to 20%, but still abysmally low. These statistics on it I got from a friend, Judge, and dredge player, as well as tournament records. But take it as you will.
 
Umm, if I have succeeded in actually decking myself with dredge, I've won unless the opponent can pull some serious shenanigans with killing their own creatures. With 4 copies of cabal therapy and 4 copies of dread return, as well a 4 bridge from below, how many counter spells do you need to keep me from going off? Let's assume that I used 3 narcomebas (so I will have 1 after milling myself.) I now have 4 bridges, and 4 cabal therapy. I sac narcomeba (bridge trigers go on the stack.) to cast cabal therapy naming.... let's say Force of Will. Do you counter this or not? Once that's done, I have 4 zombies, just saw your hand, and can therapy again if there's a counter I need to deal with (so assuming you forced, not pitching a counter, you are down 2 cards. After forcing me once I'm more likely to name Daze than another force as the odds of two forces, where you force pitching something other than force is incredibly low.) or can just go in on the dread return for flayer. You would have to have at least 3 counter spells, that are most likely free if I'm doing this turn two. And if you stop me from decking myself I just rebuild. You also seem to fail to notice the hand disruption provided by the combination of Gitaxian Probe and Cabal Therapy. And show me where you pulled those records from and actually compiled them? If it literally had such an abysmally low win rate all the time, then why would dredge in any iteration be an archetype?
 
I never said that it had an abysmally low win rate all the time. I specifically said that the win rate of it is dependent on the time elapse from a Dredge Tournament win. Dredge is a 'flavor' deck. People play it when it's good and stop when people side against it. Cyclic.

Also, my records were shown to me but I don't personally have the sources. I'll have to talk to my Judge friend.
 
White/Blue

Or I'll run mono white/mono blue. I enjoy Jace's decks.

Though my friend has a nasty vampire deck that makes me QQ
 
Mono Blue control doesn't do well against Black Vamp Aggro, although Devotion Blue does decently well depending on what they hit. So don't feel bad about it.
 
I haven't played Magic in a long time, but when I did my colors were white and... whatever worked at the time. White was my main color and I paired it with whatever I felt like!
 
All I know is that my brothe has rare cards since its from 10+ years ago..

And yeah it shit on my deck, that's why I'm going to upgrade.
 
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