Why are we never prepared for problems ?

[Kurosaki]

I ask this question . Not to be a smartass or anything . Why can't we ever be prepared for problems ? It always comes with we never have enough. There's a shortage or something like that . Just once I'd like to turn on the news and hear we have everything we need to handle this. The healthcare workers and people who keep the country running are doing a excellent job and when this is over deserve a raise!

 

[Father Figure]

We are biologically primed to notice what is lacking and what we consider essential. It's a survival mechanism of the highest order. What you have, what you've got access to, what you're been given...well, why worry about that? Why care? You've got it. You can never be prepared fully for situations like the ones that arise on global scales, whether it be economic or pandemic. Plus, telling you the world is doing A-okay isn't going to get ratings for the news agencies. They are out for money. Any other bullshit they spew is designed to garner that. So don't believe them, do your own research, make up your own mind, and learn the skill sets to recognize the skewed bias being paraded around as truth.

- Father

 

[Silk]

One thing is that because when we do in fact have good preparation and can easily handle the situation, it will be too insignificant to make it to the headlines. After all, 'car crashes, safety features save everyone' really isn't a news item anywhere.

For things like major disasters, it's just impossible to have everything ready because you can't even know what will be happening, where, and even what you would be needing.

 

[Dirty Fingers]

At the moment I blame a lot of it on Political Correctness and Left Wing politics to be honest. Example, "Why are we out of surgical masks?" Answer, China has a serious virus problem and make the majority of masks. So, why are we relying so much on offshore manufacturing when so many people in our own countries are out of work and situations like this highlight the problem?

And why do we have this pandemic in the first place? Because China, a Communist (ie Left wing ideology) hid the problem and only announced it when it was too late.

Not many people will like what I am saying here but a lot of the reason why "we" and by "we" I assume you mean "the West" as most of us here are in Western Countries, are so seldom prepared for these things is we live in societies that worry too much about others and are terrified of being called racist.

I think, finally, people are getting the message though.

 

[RedRose]

Probably because we think we got this covered, we won't need masks and shit, we're modern

 

[Dr Bellwright]

We don't hear about prevented problems. Unless we work in some specialized sphere – we only know about problems that we didn't prepare for. The job of good operations, security, and other professionals is Risk Assessment – is to make sure that risks are evaluated, they have controls, rules, and mitigations.

When something fucks up – know, we don't know about all the fuck-ups that could have happened, but didn't – we prepared.

Every time there is a storm, and cities don't collapse – it's someone's work. Every other time we had viral or bacterial outbreaks (first SARS, MERV, Ebola) and we've got them under control – it was someone's work. This one slipped through the fingers, sometimes they ought to slip, I'm grateful for civilization, operational capacity, and infrastructure that we have.

 

[Dr Bellwright]

Western Countries, are so seldom prepared for these things is we live in societies that worry too much about others and are terrified of being called racist.

Yeah. Russians who also manufacture more than 60 percent of their goods worry a lot about racism. People produce in China for the same reasons why most the startups are in San Francisco, and why most production companies in Los Angeles – there are enormous network effects in cost and productivity when people who do the same shit co-located.

Racism, PC, and other activities are not actual reasons for outsourcing, those people are just loudest, and easily noticeable, if you want to distribute capacity – one of the ways is to learn from Financial and Telecom industries, where governments make it unprofitable for Global Corporations to concentrate all their assets in one country. We still end up with hubs, in Finance it's New York, London, Frankfurt, Singapore, Tokyo, but at least we spreading it along with the world.

You need a counterforce to network effects that corporations have by concentrating everything in one place. Such as scalable taxes on imports, to make it more profitable for corporations to produce the same product in different countries. Tell somebody like H&M or Mark and Spencer, that they will pay +10% for every 10,000 product units produced in the same country, and they will spread their production capacity across multiple countries in less than two years. Right now – there is no economic incentive for people to diversify. The occasional risk of a pandemic doesn't even scratch it, we are talking about 1 year of losses in dozens of years of profit, it's an acceptable risk and loss.

 

[DaveTheHuman]

Another reason is conditioning. Imagine it's Summer 2019 and your friend just bought 100 face masks, a dozen jumbo packs of toilet paper, a dozen bottles of Tylenol, and a cart full of disinfectant. You'd probably laugh and call him/her a paranoid prepper who plans on doing unholy things to their bathroom. Then fast-forward to now, when they still have a stock of those items, and they're sitting pretty. It's common to see prepared and/or forward thinking people as nutty, and to treat them accordingly.

Wouldn't mind having a couple of those items right now lol.

 

[Shiver]

At the moment I blame a lot of it on Political Correctness and Left Wing politics to be honest. Example, "Why are we out of surgical masks?" Answer, China has a serious virus problem and make the majority of masks. So, why are we relying so much on offshore manufacturing when so many people in our own countries are out of work and situations like this highlight the problem

I have to say, I found this point to be a little hard to follow.

Outsourcing manufacturing to places like China isn't done to be nice to Chinese people. It's done because it's cheaper for companies to manufacture where wages are lower and standards are more lax; in other words, it's a completely conservative, free-market capitalist phenomenon. It's the opposite of left-wing politics.

 

[Silk]

I have to say, I found this point to be a little hard to follow.

Outsourcing manufacturing to places like China isn't done to be nice to Chinese people. It's done because it's cheaper for companies to manufacture where wages are lower and standards are more lax; in other words, it's a completely conservative, free-market capitalist phenomenon. It's the opposite of left-wing politics.

This so very much. It's all an economic and rational decision. The irrational one is wanting to have all manufacturing done in the own country. But funnily enough, people generally aren't willing to pay the higher prices that that would take. And then of course there is the issue that it is absolutely inefficient to make everything everywhere. If it's even at all economical to have every country producing everything.

 

[Dirty Fingers]

I have to say, I found this point to be a little hard to follow.

Outsourcing manufacturing to places like China isn't done to be nice to Chinese people. It's done because it's cheaper for companies to manufacture where wages are lower and standards are more lax; in other words, it's a completely conservative, free-market capitalist phenomenon. It's the opposite of left-wing politics.

This so very much. It's all an economic and rational decision. The irrational one is wanting to have all manufacturing done in the own country. But funnily enough, people generally aren't willing to pay the higher prices that that would take. And then of course there is the issue that it is absolutely inefficient to make everything everywhere. If it's even at all economical to have every country producing everything.

It's not that rational really. It is blind greed. I am not just talking about manufacturing either, I am talking outsourcing jobs in general. I deal with this with my work and the lack of knowledge, lack of professional standards some of these countries have ends up costing via blunders and even just time itself.

You also have to look at the bigger picture. We have an economy that relies on people spending money. If people don't have money or jobs then the economy takes a hit and results in other issues as well such as crime and anti social activities. This in turn also effects big business.

In the end, what works is looking out for your own. No point in a company outsourcing production and jobs overseas if no one at home will be able to buy the products/services.

 

[Shiver]

It's not that rational really. It is blind greed. I am not just talking about manufacturing either, I am talking outsourcing jobs in general. I deal with this with my work and the lack of knowledge, lack of professional standards some of these countries have ends up costing via blunders and even just time itself.

You also have to look at the bigger picture. We have an economy that relies on people spending money. If people don't have money or jobs then the economy takes a hit and results in other issues as well such as crime and anti social activities. This in turn also effects big business.

In the end, what works is looking out for your own. No point in a company outsourcing production and jobs overseas if no one at home will be able to buy the products/services.

I don't necessarily disagree with any of that. But it isn't caused in any way by "political correctness gone wrong" or left-wing politics; it's driven entirely by right wing, free market capitalism. Introducing regulation to cut down on outsourcing and protect domestic workers would be a pro-labour, left wing position.

 

[Dirty Fingers]

I don't necessarily disagree with any of that. But it isn't caused in any way by "political correctness gone wrong" or left-wing politics; it's driven entirely by right wing, free market capitalism. Introducing regulation to cut down on outsourcing and protect domestic workers would be a pro-labour, left wing position.

Of course it is Left wing. Another prime example of "never being prepared" is terrorism. Denied for years by the Left and still denied even when it happens.

 

[Shiver]

Of course it is Left wing.

...it isn't.

Free market capitalism with few regulations is the right wing position.

Government intervention to regulate business behaviour (what you're asking for) is the left wing position.

 

[Silk]

Of course it is Left wing. Another prime example of "never being prepared" is terrorism. Denied for years by the Left and still denied even when it happens.

Terrorism actually is a very minor issue at best in the western world. It is much more of a problem in other countries (like my native Pakistan) but there, it is a strong example of conservative right wing politics interacting with worldwide forces, including western right-wing military endeavours.

And mind you, the largest terrorist attack to take place in the West was under a decidedly right wing government.

And seriously, you might want to look at what politically left and right mean when talking about economics.

 

[Dirty Fingers]

...it isn't.

Free market capitalism with few regulations is the right wing position.

Government intervention to regulate business behaviour (what you're asking for) is the left wing position.

Hmmmm... think more deeply. The Left like to break down certain groups to make other groups feel like they are progressing.

Terrorism actually is a very minor issue at best in the western world. It is much more of a problem in other countries (like my native Pakistan) but there, it is a strong example of conservative right wing politics interacting with worldwide forces, including western right-wing military endeavours.

And mind you, the largest terrorist attack to take place in the West was under a decidedly right wing government.

And seriously, you might want to look at what politically left and right mean when talking about economics.

I would say people getting driven over in the street, knifed etc is a pretty big issue for countries that didn't have these issues before Islamic immigration. You may seriously want to look at the world without your blinkers on. Just because violence of that kind may be common in Pakistan doesn't mean it was common elsewhere or considered acceptable, despite what the mayor of London may want people to believe.

 

[Silk]

[
QUOTE="Dirty Fingers, post: 2882473, member: 37872"]
Hmmmm... think more deeply. The Left like to break down certain groups to make other groups feel like they are progressing.

I would say people getting driven over in the street, knifed etc is a pretty big issue for countries that didn't have these issues before Islamic immigration. You may seriously want to look at the world without your blinkers on. Just because violence of that kind may be common in Pakistan doesn't mean it was common elsewhere or considered acceptable, despite what the mayor of London may want people to believe.
[/QUOTE]

Uhm, that is pretty small scale and it's not like political violence is utterly unknown in the West. There have been and are plenty of things like the Troubles and political fribge idiots murdering innocents. Mind you, I'm not saying that terrorism is good or acceptable, but it really isn't this huge thing that you're making it out to be.

But let's drop that, it isn't really about the topic at hand and leave your paranoia about the left behind.

Funnily enough, I'm not even on the left, being a liberal in the European sense. I however don't like groups being misrepresented and demonised.

 

[Dirty Fingers]

[
QUOTE="Dirty Fingers, post: 2882473, member: 37872"]
Hmmmm... think more deeply. The Left like to break down certain groups to make other groups feel like they are progressing.

I would say people getting driven over in the street, knifed etc is a pretty big issue for countries that didn't have these issues before Islamic immigration. You may seriously want to look at the world without your blinkers on. Just because violence of that kind may be common in Pakistan doesn't mean it was common elsewhere or considered acceptable, despite what the mayor of London may want people to believe.

Uhm, that is pretty small scale and it's not like political violence is utterly unknown in the West. There have been and are plenty of things like the Troubles and political fribge idiots murdering innocents. Mind you, I'm not saying that terrorism is good or acceptable, but it really isn't this huge thing that you're making it out to be.

But let's drop that, it isn't really about the topic at hand and leave your paranoia about the left behind.

Funnily enough, I'm not even on the left, being a liberal in the European sense. I however don't like groups being misrepresented and demonised.
[/QUOTE]

That is the problem we are having here Silk. You don't understand. Just because things might be worse somewhere else and even accepted as normal somewhere else it doesn't mean it is a good thing nor should it be accepted in other places on the basis of "yeah, but it's nothing like what happens over there". That is flawed thinking.

Paranoia? Nah, but your personal attacks give you away.

It's very much on topic too by the way and you assist in proving why we are so ill prepared for these things. While I speak in very straight up terms you cry about misrepresentation and how things are worse elsewhere and make excuse after excuse.

Your way of treading lightly is part of the problem.

 

[Xanaphia]

Just when you think the bar can't go any lower, someone shows up with a shovel to dig a tunnel beneath it.

 

[RedRose]

I do agree, we rarely hear of prevented problems. Maybe we should.
As for using other countries - that's not PC, that's capitalism: less expensive, or whatever.

 

[Dr Bellwright]

The Left like to break down certain groups to make other groups

Oh wow, it's all Left-Wing's fault. Alright, I mean sure, they are people in expensive suits, they must be guilty of something! Also, they are viciously smart, they got 3,000 old memos from Romans to Divide and Conquer

 

[Dirty Fingers]

I do agree, we rarely hear of prevented problems. Maybe we should.
As for using other countries - that's not PC, that's capitalism: less expensive, or whatever.

I suggest you look at what the United Nations as well as other PC organizations do and why.

Oh wow, it's all Left-Wing's fault. Alright, I mean sure, they are people in expensive suits, they must be guilty of something! Also, they are viciously smart, they got 3,000 old memos from Romans to Divide and Conquer

Uh huh, I have to say that I have noted that not many of you are really saying anything here. Excuses, personal attacks, sarcasm, insults, sure. But no real points ever get made.

You guys are a great example of why shit never gets done and why society is never prepared.

 

[Dr Bellwright]

@Dirty Fingers you are trying to oversimplify extremely complex interaction between dozens of millions of people, who directly participate in decisions that involve Outsourcing, PC, Economics, Production, into the overly simplistic and tribalistic concepts of Us versus Them, Left versus Right.

When people try to simplify concepts, they are either geniuses, who found an easier way to look at the problem or simply are wrong, and should maybe iterate on different ideas. You haven't made your case yet. All you do is blaming Left Wing, UN, PC of things that they didn't instigate, they react to them, but they didn't do anything proactive initially.

I'm not saying you are wrong, but your interpretation – seems to the public here to be wrong, myself included. And when people keep iterating on the same perceivable-wrong idea, they make it very hard for the public to take them seriously. If you are interested in just venting, that's alright, and who am I to stop it. But if you actually want to change somebody's mind – maybe bring some research and facts, and don't switch between topics. Shiver and you started to talk about Trade, but then you switched to Terrorism. Finish with one topic, otherwise, it looks like you are avoiding digging into a problem and switching between them.

 

[Dirty Fingers]

@Dirty Fingers you are trying to oversimplify extremely complex interaction between dozens of millions of people, who directly participate in decisions that involve Outsourcing, PC, Economics, Production, into the overly simplistic and tribalistic concepts of Us versus Them, Left versus Right.

When people try to simplify concepts, they are either geniuses, who found an easier way to look at the problem or simply are wrong, and should maybe iterate on different ideas. You haven't made your case yet. All you do is blaming Left Wing, UN, PC of things that they didn't instigate, they react to them, but they didn't do anything proactive initially.

I'm not saying you are wrong, but your interpretation – seems to the public here to be wrong, myself included. And when people keep iterating on the same perceivable-wrong idea, they make it very hard for the public to take them seriously. If you are interested in just venting, that's alright, and who am I to stop it. But if you actually want to change somebody's mind – maybe bring some research and facts, and don't switch between topics. Shiver and you started to talk about Trade, but then you switched to Terrorism. Finish with one topic, otherwise, it looks like you are avoiding digging into a problem and switching between them.

On the contrary. You are trying to sound intelligent by making it far more complex than it has to be. And yet, again, I am forced to repeat myself. You haven't made any points yet. Not sure if you have noticed the title of the thread, why are we never prepared? Think about that.

The public here think I am wrong? That is hardly cause for concern. I have been around these sites for a while now and I am aware that most people on them are very Left wing and rather zealous about it. I and many other conservatives have been banned from sites like this simply because the Admins and Mods did not like our politics. It never helps either that we were winning the debates. While you carry on about myself having to convince you lot, you don't factor in that your combined efforts haven't convinced me of anything.

I guess that is why I have been quite laid back in this discussion as I know it won't matter how many facts I bring forward. In fact, as I have seen many times, the facts often lead to people getting butt hurt and then the conservative being banned. I don't really care if I am banned or not. I just don't feel like that happening today or you having the satisfaction that you got rid of me.

I have tried having a discussion about this topic with you. You will, no doubt refute that but I have already picked up on the hostility displayed to me as I feel that I have disrupted people's safe places.

As an experiment though it has been fascinating. And I stand by what I said when I stated that people like yourselves are the reason why we are never prepared. Excuses, excuses, crying, focusing on the trivial and small mindedness.

I never wanted this to get into name calling attacks however, as you lot seemed to think that was appropriate I don't mind sinking to your level very briefly and giving it back to you.

Would you like to go crying to a Mod now?

 

[Dr Bellwright]

@Dirty Fingers – Wow. Didn't really mean to rile you up, didn't expect this kind of reaction, I'm sorry. Peace?